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Day 30 - Live Final Tribal Council - Page 2 - Stranded in Tanzania
By Aaron
Posts
#54810
Kara wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:32 pm
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:03:19 pm Hey Everyone. Thanks first and foremost for all the detailed questions and comments. Obviously, some was hard to hear but others i'm sure for all of us was good to hear. One thing that has been discussed over the past few days that I believe needs more context is the phrase “you have all played three distinctive games”. This phrase has been thrown out there over, and over, and over. Based on my understanding of each finalist’s responses, which I have frankly spent too much time reading. I have spent a lot of time discussing my game, and for my first message, I’d like to provide a little more context on what I feel about the games of the two people sitting next to me.

Kara- Kara’s game was two-fold. On one side, she was a “very visible figure” due to the fact that she made fun of people or “called them out” after the vote didn’t go their way. She was very much able to get away with this due to the second part of her game…which was the “under the radar” piece. By her own admission, Kara ended up “taking a back seat strategically” to John, Alison, and Ang. The move she touted as her “MVP move” was voting out John, a move that even without her was already in motion (as I explained in my answer to John). If Kara decided not to vote John out, the result would have still been the same. Keep in mind Kara’s additional end game strategy also came up short at every turn- an attempt to flip the vote to save Nick and vote out Jack (which failed), an attempt to flip the votes AGAIN at the very next tribal council to save Alison and vote out Tommy (which also failed), and a prayer that I would be able to convince Jack to flip his vote (which he, by this point, already made evident would be for Kara) to bring her to the end (which I did). The bold part of Kara’s game was her ability to make fun of people. Her strategic contributions to the game, to her own admission, were non-existent.

Jack- A great personal story of redemption that falls a few steps short of crossing the finishing line. Throughout Jack’s answers, he often references to the fact that he “sunk into the shadows” and “allowed the game to be managed by the larger personalities”. Maybe it’s just me, but I didn’t see a point in the game following the flip where Jack controlled his own fate. I love Jack as a person, and I hate being overly critical, but I came here to win- and there are too many holes in Jack’s game to corroborate a story that has him “finding his opportunity”. You were hurt after the response you got to the flip, and you bailed. I told you before you went away to the cabin weekend, “suit up, it’s time for us to go to war.” I pitched the plan to you, and like a great soldier, you followed through. You were a great soldier in my army, which I think defines your end game rather well.
Please note aaron mansplaining the games of jack and I. He's wanted to goat jack the entire end game while I wanted to vote Jack out as you all seen. He took out Tommy because he wasn't confident in his own game and is now trying to discredit the games of the two people he assumed he could beat.
I explained the way I read your answers. I didn't mean to mansplain anything, I apologize if that came off that way, that wasn't my intention.

I would allude to my answer to Tommy with regards to my confidence piece.

Also, not discrediting anyone- everyone who is here deserves to be here. I am simply reading your answers, and relaying the messaging.
 

Aaron

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By Nick
Posts
#54811
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:10:04 pm
Kara wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:06:24 pm Aaron, you couldn't win an immunity this season- Jack and I have both won two. Numerous times I wanted to target you early on in the merge but people pushed it aside because you sucked at challenges and were easily beatable. Was this a part of your strategy? And why should the jury discount the fact that Jack and I hold 2 wins and still vote for you?
I couldn't win immunity, correct. So I had to make up for my lack of challenge prowess in other areas. I had to work twice as hard on my social interactions as everyone here because I knew I wasn't going to be able to pull these out. Was I as bad in challenges as I lead on? No. I made it to the end during quite a few. But if I spoke it into existence enough, I knew I wouldn't have the target on my back as say a Nick who was unstoppable.
Kara does bring up a good point because I remember one of the reasons why getting the votes on to you was difficult was because you sucked a challenges and you could've easily went at the final 4-5 because immunities weren't your thing. I do think it is a sign of weakness for you because it did make you look like easily beaten. Now if you were pretending to suck at challenges in order to seem less threatening, then that's a different story but obviously this one opinion of you won't make me change my vote drastically.
 

Nick

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By Jack
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#54813
Nick wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:29 pm So Jack, I will say I came into final tribal council not really expecting myself to vote you but the way you answered my tribal council question today made me really reconsider you. I learned more about you reading that paragraph then I had learned the whole time I spent with you. You perfectly answered my question, and so I commend you for that.
Thanks, Nick. It was from the heart.
Nick liked this
 

Jack

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By Carl
Posts
#54814
Also while I'm not going to discredit someone for not winning challenges, I do think there should be some credit given to both Jack and Kara for the challenges they won. Kara won always in contention for challenges and Jack won literally the most important challenge in the game. I'm sure we all know that but I do want to make sure credit is given where its due.
Alison, Jack liked this
 

Carl

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By Dean
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#54815
Jack. Why did you never mention that you played these types of games before? Was it because you forgot, it was just never brought up, you were you purposefully hiding that information from us?
 

Dean

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By Nick
Posts
#54817
I do give Jack some brownie points as well for winning the final 4 immunity challenge considering it was probably one of the longest and hardest challenges this season.
Tommy, Jack liked this
 

Nick

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By Aaron
Posts
#54818
Nick wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:29 pm So Jack, I will say I came into final tribal council not really expecting myself to vote you but the way you answered my tribal council question today made me really reconsider you. I learned more about you reading that paragraph then I had learned the whole time I spent with you. You perfectly answered my question, and so I commend you for that.

Kara, I was a bit upset with your response to me because the Davie vote wasn't super significant. I do feel like it brought my views about you a bit but I'm still considering you as my vote. Instead of pointing out a vote, could you just generalize for me why you think you're a strategic player because that aspect of the game for you is still unclear.

Aaron, great response, I just felt it was a bit ingenuine only because I get the feeling that you are just buttering myself and everyone else up rather then actually telling me how you really felt. Loved your game though, but I'll definitely be watching how you respond to everyone else's questions tonight because my vote is still undecided but I don't have any questions for you at the very moment.
I mean I promise you that was how I genuinely felt. You can ask Tommy, and you can ask Alison who I thought the biggest threat in this game was. I'm not sure if that's the piece you felt was disingenuous. But, I spoke the truth in all of my answers.
 

Aaron

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By Tommy
Posts
#54819
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:13:20 pm
Kara wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:32 pm
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:03:19 pm Hey Everyone. Thanks first and foremost for all the detailed questions and comments. Obviously, some was hard to hear but others i'm sure for all of us was good to hear. One thing that has been discussed over the past few days that I believe needs more context is the phrase “you have all played three distinctive games”. This phrase has been thrown out there over, and over, and over. Based on my understanding of each finalist’s responses, which I have frankly spent too much time reading. I have spent a lot of time discussing my game, and for my first message, I’d like to provide a little more context on what I feel about the games of the two people sitting next to me.

Kara- Kara’s game was two-fold. On one side, she was a “very visible figure” due to the fact that she made fun of people or “called them out” after the vote didn’t go their way. She was very much able to get away with this due to the second part of her game…which was the “under the radar” piece. By her own admission, Kara ended up “taking a back seat strategically” to John, Alison, and Ang. The move she touted as her “MVP move” was voting out John, a move that even without her was already in motion (as I explained in my answer to John). If Kara decided not to vote John out, the result would have still been the same. Keep in mind Kara’s additional end game strategy also came up short at every turn- an attempt to flip the vote to save Nick and vote out Jack (which failed), an attempt to flip the votes AGAIN at the very next tribal council to save Alison and vote out Tommy (which also failed), and a prayer that I would be able to convince Jack to flip his vote (which he, by this point, already made evident would be for Kara) to bring her to the end (which I did). The bold part of Kara’s game was her ability to make fun of people. Her strategic contributions to the game, to her own admission, were non-existent.

Jack- A great personal story of redemption that falls a few steps short of crossing the finishing line. Throughout Jack’s answers, he often references to the fact that he “sunk into the shadows” and “allowed the game to be managed by the larger personalities”. Maybe it’s just me, but I didn’t see a point in the game following the flip where Jack controlled his own fate. I love Jack as a person, and I hate being overly critical, but I came here to win- and there are too many holes in Jack’s game to corroborate a story that has him “finding his opportunity”. You were hurt after the response you got to the flip, and you bailed. I told you before you went away to the cabin weekend, “suit up, it’s time for us to go to war.” I pitched the plan to you, and like a great soldier, you followed through. You were a great soldier in my army, which I think defines your end game rather well.
Please note aaron mansplaining the games of jack and I. He's wanted to goat jack the entire end game while I wanted to vote Jack out as you all seen. He took out Tommy because he wasn't confident in his own game and is now trying to discredit the games of the two people he assumed he could beat.
I explained the way I read your answers. I didn't mean to mansplain anything, I apologize if that came off that way, that wasn't my intention.

I would allude to my answer to Tommy with regards to my confidence piece.

Also, not discrediting anyone- everyone who is here deserves to be here. I am simply reading your answers, and relaying the messaging.
So does that meant I played 4 times as hard a social game? (The confidence portion)
 

Tommy

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By Alison
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#54820
i will be clear im not discrediting anything, Jacks final challenge win was the thing that made me believe he deserved to be here. I just wanted to hear the reasoning behind "YoU dIdNt WiN aNy ChAlLeNgEs" argument at this point, we have much bigger things to talk about.
Carl liked this
 

Alison

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By Tommy
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#54821
Jack wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:14:49 pm
Nick wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:29 pm So Jack, I will say I came into final tribal council not really expecting myself to vote you but the way you answered my tribal council question today made me really reconsider you. I learned more about you reading that paragraph then I had learned the whole time I spent with you. You perfectly answered my question, and so I commend you for that.
Thanks, Nick. It was from the heart.
It was a great answer Jack. Really loved it
Jack, Alison liked this
 

Tommy

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By Kara
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#54822
Aaron didn't win immunity and worked hard in other areas yes, but I won immunity and was also never a target for any of you really- to the point where it was actually threatening to my game. I worked hard in both areas- and succeeded.
Tommy liked this
 

Kara

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By Dean
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#54824
Kara. You said to me you had three shields in front of you for most of the game. I want to know, was this always going to be your plan and your game strategy even before we started the game, or did it naturally come to this? Why did you feel like letting them do the flashy work while you took a backseat was best for your game? And I don't mean to just get to the end, but to use as a plan to actually get to the end and win.
Alison liked this
 

Dean

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By Jack
Posts
#54827
Dean wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:16:35 pm Jack. Why did you never mention that you played these types of games before? Was it because you forgot, it was just never brought up, you were you purposefully hiding that information from us?
I was definitely hiding that information. I thought it might give people another reason to target me. I remember someone saying, I think it was you?, that they suspected one of us to be a returning player and I got the impression that was working against them.
 

Jack

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By Tommy
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#54828
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:17:28 pm
Nick wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:29 pm So Jack, I will say I came into final tribal council not really expecting myself to vote you but the way you answered my tribal council question today made me really reconsider you. I learned more about you reading that paragraph then I had learned the whole time I spent with you. You perfectly answered my question, and so I commend you for that.

Kara, I was a bit upset with your response to me because the Davie vote wasn't super significant. I do feel like it brought my views about you a bit but I'm still considering you as my vote. Instead of pointing out a vote, could you just generalize for me why you think you're a strategic player because that aspect of the game for you is still unclear.

Aaron, great response, I just felt it was a bit ingenuine only because I get the feeling that you are just buttering myself and everyone else up rather then actually telling me how you really felt. Loved your game though, but I'll definitely be watching how you respond to everyone else's questions tonight because my vote is still undecided but I don't have any questions for you at the very moment.
I mean I promise you that was how I genuinely felt. You can ask Tommy, and you can ask Alison who I thought the biggest threat in this game was. I'm not sure if that's the piece you felt was disingenuous. But, I spoke the truth in all of my answers.
We were all worried about your challenge prowess Nick. I personally thought we played similar games and you would have been fun to go H2H against, but it was smart to vote you out when we did. You probably would have won out.
 

Tommy

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By Aaron
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#54829
Tommy wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:11:55 pm
Aaron wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:10:04 pm
Kara wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:06:24 pm Aaron, you couldn't win an immunity this season- Jack and I have both won two. Numerous times I wanted to target you early on in the merge but people pushed it aside because you sucked at challenges and were easily beatable. Was this a part of your strategy? And why should the jury discount the fact that Jack and I hold 2 wins and still vote for you?
I couldn't win immunity, correct. So I had to make up for my lack of challenge prowess in other areas. I had to work twice as hard on my social interactions as everyone here because I knew I wasn't going to be able to pull these out. Was I as bad in challenges as I lead on? No. I made it to the end during quite a few. But if I spoke it into existence enough, I knew I wouldn't have the target on my back as say a Nick who was unstoppable.
"Work twice as hard" is kinda horseshit. Most of us worked really hard socially. How did you work harder? Sounds like just something good to say.

First off as a message to everyone, I apologize for the delay in response- a lot of questions are flying out here and i'm trying to keep up with all of them without missing, so if I'm a fuckhead and miss your question don't feel bad just tagging me in it or whatever...

So in response to working twice as hard, maybe that comparison wasn't right- maybe a correct way of saying it would be I had to put twice as much energy as I would typically into social manuvering due to the fact that I knew my shot at an idol was slim....maybe that's the correct way. My intention wasn't to say I worked harder than everyone, just painting the picture of where the majority of my energy went due to my issues with challenges.
Tommy liked this
 

Aaron

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By Alison
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#54830
Tommy wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:18:54 pm
Jack wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:14:49 pm
Nick wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:08:29 pm So Jack, I will say I came into final tribal council not really expecting myself to vote you but the way you answered my tribal council question today made me really reconsider you. I learned more about you reading that paragraph then I had learned the whole time I spent with you. You perfectly answered my question, and so I commend you for that.
Thanks, Nick. It was from the heart.
It was a great answer Jack. Really loved it
I also loved this answer. It definitely felt like I was getting to see inside your head and that was very helpful to me.
 

Alison

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By Carl
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#54831
Carl wrote: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:13:19 pm Sorry to interrupt this little debate but I do want to make sure I ask some follow ups to my questions from my thread:

Aaron: That's nice to hear about what we would have talked about and I would have loved to go to the end with you too but I did also ask what did you do specifically to shift your gameplan after I left? What became your ideal Final 3 and when did that come about? Is it the two people you are sitting with now?

Kara: You talk about this briefly in your response to John but I was curious about when you had planned on going after John while Angelina was still in this game. Did you always plan on taking out John at Final 8 or did that get sped up once Angelina was already gone from your alliance?
Going to double up on this as well to ask another question for everyone. We've heard a lot about people's best moves or MVP moves but what do you guys think is the best move made by each of the other two people sitting with you?
 

Carl

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